Episode 39: The Seinfeld Theme Song
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Transcript
Transcript
Time Crisis, late March.
We'll be talking to Lush Life, my old friend.
Plus, Jonathan Wolfe, composer of the Seinfeld theme song.
All this, plus we count down the hits of 1989 and today.
It's almost spring, and this is...
Time Crisis with Ezra King.
B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-spot one.
They passed me by, all of those great romances.
The war I felt, wobbly me, all my rightful chances.
My picture clear, everything seemed so easy.
And so I dealt you the blow, one of us had to go.
Now it's different, I want you to know.
One of us is crying, one of us is lying.
Leave a lonely man.
Time Crisis, we're back.
What's up, Jake?
Hey.
How you doing, man?
Pretty good.
Did you listen to the new Drake playlist?
No.
Do you care about Drake?
No, I mean, I'm fine with them, but I don't--
You respect Drake?
Yeah, sure.
But so when a new Drake album or playlist comes out,
you're not rushing to listen to it?
Didn't even hear about it.
You didn't know that he dropped a new playlist?
How would I know about that?
Where do you first see that?
Where do I first see that?
Something like that I'd probably first see on social media.
Okay, so you're on Twitter.
You wake up--
I don't check Twitter every day, but--
Really?
Yeah, no.
I find that shocking.
I've been weaning myself off.
It's toxic right now.
It's brutal.
Nobody needs to check Twitter every day.
But I think somebody just told me,
"Oh, the new Drake thing is out."
So like a friend texted you?
Yeah.
Was like, "Oh, did you hear that?"
Yeah, because there's a lot of people that I know
who would be like, "What do you think of the new Drake?"
I need an answer.
But Drake made-- it's not an album, it's a playlist.
Kind of like my Home Depot playlist?
Well, it's all original music.
Oh.
It's presented as a playlist.
Is it a little more casual than--
Yeah, maybe it's a little more casual.
There's some like fun moments where people are just talking.
It's like a lateral move from a mixtape?
That's a good way to look at it.
But everybody was talking about it when it came out last week.
Haven't heard it.
You haven't heard any of it?
Nope.
I mentioned to you that there was a reference on it.
So this is a song called "Lose You."
I don't care what society thinks.
They're nothing anyway.
They're no better than me.
You just have to fit into a pattern.
If somebody's on a hit, I'm for you.
The life we live, you have to set your own patterns,
your own ideals.
You have to handle the whole job yourself.
Yeah.
That's a Canadian biker speaking.
Like bicyclist?
No, like a Hells Angel type.
Oh, like a--
[MUSIC - DRAKE, "LOSE YOU"]
Oh, you get the idea of the vibe of the song.
There's a specific line I wanted you to hear.
[MUSIC - DRAKE, "LOSE YOU"]
Drake often has songs like this on his albums,
mixtapes, whatever, that's kind of like where he's
kind of in a reflective mode.
And he's kind of thinking about how he can't trust anybody,
and how there's so many fake people,
and how the more famous and rich you get, you get new problems.
He always has these songs where he's kind of like--
Did he do "Straight to my face?"
Is that Drake?
"Straight up to my face?"
Yeah, about people who lie to you.
So he's really on that Bob Dylan, Positively 4th Street
tip.
He loves that mode.
Of just being like, yeah, all the fake people who you just
want to be on the side that's winning.
Yeah.
So--
When I was down, you just stood there grinning.
And it's kind of like, oh, you liked me when I was starting.
People don't like you once you've made it.
[MUSIC - DRAKE, "LOSE YOU"]
Be honest with myself and take ownership.
Opinions started to burn when tables started to turn.
I really used to feel like they loved the [BLEEP]
at first.
Exciting times revitalized, trust this little light of mine.
It's going to shine positively.
But listen to this.
I'm mistaken, but God will give me.
Grateful like Jerry, Bob, and Mickey.
Better attitude, we'll see where it gets me.
I did.
Rewind.
What did you say, Drake?
Grateful like Jerry, Bob, and Mickey.
Better attitude, we'll see where it gets me.
I don't catch in flies and honey, it's still sticky.
I wrote the book--
Jerry, Bob, and Mickey.
So to anybody at home who doesn't know what Drake means
when he says that he's grateful like Jerry, Bob, and Mickey,
he's referencing the Grateful Dead, one of Jake's
all-time favorite bands.
He rhymes Mickey with give me.
No, well, he-- no, then he says sticky.
Listen to the whole line.
Oh, wait.
Grateful like Jerry, Bob, and Mickey.
Better attitude, we'll see where it gets me.
I don't catch in flies and honey, it's still sticky.
OK.
No, is that--
That's a good point.
Is that a reference to the Grateful Dead honey bear?
You know, one of their logos is like the bear?
I don't think so.
[LAUGHS]
But anyway, the main thing I want to talk about
is I feel like the Grateful Dead doesn't get a ton of shout outs
in modern pop music, let alone name-checking three members.
Like, first of all, Jerry Garcia is an icon, very famous.
Bob Weir, to a lesser extent.
Mickey, that's deep.
Mickey Hart.
Mickey Hart is the drummer.
Second drummer.
Second drummer in the Dead.
You know, I'm sure Drake chose it for the rhyme
because Mickey rhymes with sticky.
Yeah.
The one tough thing about this is that as much as I'm sure
the living members of the Grateful Dead
appreciate the shout out, perhaps just due
to syllabic constraints, Drake did not shout out
every member of the band.
Didn't shout out Phil Lesh.
And he specifically didn't shout out Phil Lesh,
who's the bassist.
Kind of like the sweet-natured, often forgotten bassist.
Doesn't have the flash of the Jerry, Bob, or Mickey.
Iconic in his own right.
So, you know, just imagine that you're Phil Lesh's
grandchildren, and you hear that your grandpa's band
got shouted out on a Drake song.
I think that's pretty cool.
And you're like, Grandpa Phil, the biggest rapper in the world,
just shouted out Grateful Dead on his new playlist.
And Phil Lesh's like, oh, I didn't know Drake
had a new playlist.
That's pretty cool.
He's like, what is a playlist?
No, I think Phil Lesh is up on that.
Oh, that's interesting.
Drake's always having fun with the album form.
What did he say?
And they said, well, he said he's grateful,
like Jerry, Bob, and Mickey.
And Phil Lesh says, hmm, okay.
Mickey wasn't even a founding member.
Well, that's great, guys.
Couldn't he have gone grateful like Jerry, Bob, Phil, and Mickey?
Just cram it in.
I'm just taking what God will give me.
Grateful like Jerry, Bob, and Mickey.
Better attitude, we'll see where it gets me.
I know catching flies with honey is still sticky.
I wrote the book on world-class finesses and tasteful gestures
and making efforts and never placing second.
Even better, knowing you first, but then taking second.
Inspiring and never taking credit.
I know I deserve more.
I just never said it.
Two middle fingers as I make an exit.
Yeah.
Did I lose you?
Did I?
Did I lose you?
Did I?
Did I lose you?
Winning is problematic.
People like you more when you working towards something,
not when you have it.
Way less support from my peers in recent years
as I get established.
Unforgiving times, but I manage.
Why is my struggle different than others?
Only child is taking care of his mother.
His health worsens, his bills double.
That's not respectable.
All of a sudden, I don't get a pat on the back for the come up.
What do you see when you see me?
When did all the things I mean from the bottom of my heart
start to lose meaning?
Maybe I shared with too many people.
Back then, the usages feel like our secret.
Back when I would write and not think about how to receive it,
I'd be trying to manifest the things I needed.
And look now, I mean, it's hard to believe it even for me.
But you're mindful of it all when you're mindful of it all.
How'd it go from not wanting me at all
to wanting to see me lose it all?
Things get dark when my heart just starts glowing.
I'm overcome with emotions, ones I can't access
when I'm stone sober.
Jealous ones still envy and turn King Cobra.
I could only speak what I know.
Man, we wrote the book on calculated thinking
and Icy Hanna can drink it.
And rival neighborhoods linking and putting your trust
in someone with the risk of financially sinking.
All you did was write the book on garbage-ass rollies,
ego stroking, picture posting.
Claiming that you do it for motivational purposes only,
but you just had to show me.
See, I know 'cause I study you closely.
I know when someone lying.
I know there's people standing for nothing or getting tired.
I know what we're both thinking even when you're quiet.
Sometimes I gotta just make sure that I didn't lose you.
Did I?
Did I?
Did I lose you?
Did I?
Did I?
Did I lose you?
Wait, is Phil the only person that he's really passing over here?
Well, no. There's Pigpen.
There's Pigpen.
R.I.P. He died in like 1970.
He died early.
And then there's Keith Godchow, who replaced Pigpen.
But he's kind of like a touring member?
Yeah, I mean, he was probably in the mid-'70s records.
Well, that's not fair either, but definitely the most egregious.
Donna Godchow as well.
Oh, his wife?
Yeah.
She play a little fiddle too?
No, I think just vocals.
Oh, I'm thinking somebody else.
But Phil is definitely the most egregious omission here.
Yeah.
Mickey Hart, interesting story.
One of their great songs is called "He's Gone."
Mm-hmm.
It's on Europe 72.
But anyway, that's about Mickey Hart's dad who was managing the dead.
Oh, and ripping them off?
And then stole a bunch of their money and then absconded.
Just vaporized, left, and then so they wrote "He's Gone" about it.
It's one thing to steal money, but to abscond with it is--
that's hitting somebody one day.
And I think-- I could be getting this wrong,
but I feel like the vibe was so bad after that
that they kicked Mickey Hart out
because Bill Kreutzman is the only drummer on the Europe 72 album.
But then Mickey Hart came back mid-'70s.
I think for a while they had to just be like, "Dude, your dad ripped us off.
You're not going on this tour."
That's a tough position to be in if your dad ripped off the band.
Can you imagine?
That's rough.
Also, I got to say, I wish there were tapes of them talking about that
because it must be hilarious.
Because that must just be some straight-up Big Lebowski sh--
is a bunch of zonked-out hippies talking about financial matters.
That is always funny.
Oh my God.
Just kind of like, "Mickey, man, your dad made off with the bread, man.
You know, we were out there touring, man.
And yeah, your dad took the bread and he absconded, man.
He absconded with the bread, man.
Bob, am I wrong here?
No, Jerry, that's a real harsh move your dad pulled, man.
That's not cool."
That's a real harsh toke.
That's a real harsh toke, Mickey.
And like, "I don't know if I'm comfortable with the son of a bread absconder
keeping time behind me, man."
We just got to move forward here, guys.
We got to.
What's done is done.
Yeah.
Water under the bridge, man, but that's not cool.
That's a harsh toke on the bong of existence.
They got it together.
You know better but I know him
Like I told you, what I said
Steal your face right off your head
Now he's gone
Now he's gone
But he's gone
He's gone
Like a steam locomotive
Running down the track
He's gone
But he's gonna bring him back
He's gone
Time Crisis with Ezra Koenig.
Well, anyway, that's quite a start to the show.
We already talked about Drake and the Grateful Dead.
We got a big one coming up, Jake.
We have two guests today calling in.
We're going to be talking about Ed Sheeran.
We're going to be talking about Mike Sheeran.
The Ed Sheeran news just doesn't stop.
Oh, there's news?
Oh, yeah, there's news.
We'll get into that a little bit later.
But the two guests we have today,
one is my buddy Raj,
also professionally known as the rapper Lush Life,
who I grew up with.
He wrote a great moving op-ed for the Washington Post recently
about the violence against South Asians
that's been happening in America.
So he's going to call in, going to catch up and talk.
And then on a lighter note,
we also have Jonathan Wolfe,
the composer of the Seinfeld theme.
We've really gotten some, like, top-shelf guests.
That's big, man.
Yeah, I know.
[imitates guitar]
I just want to point out, you know,
when Sound Crisis first started,
I'll admit we had some real top-shelf guests.
We had stars of films and programs.
We came out of the gate hot, yep.
We had Jamie Foxx.
That was memorable.
One day maybe we'll get back to that,
the real high-level stars.
In the meantime,
between the Seinfeld theme song composer
and the invention of the Flamin' Hot Cheetos bagel,
I think we're getting coverage on Time Crisis
that you're really not going to find anywhere else.
You're listening to...
Time Crisis on Beats 1.
A lot of breath.
A lot of bread, man.
That was a lot of bread
that your dad, like, absconded with, man.
And... [laughs]
Oh, man, that was just Mickey in the hot seat.
Okay, but anyway,
just a little bit of background about Raj.
Lush Life.
I call him Raj 'cause I've known him since back in the day.
Yep.
He was almost like a mentor figure for me.
I don't know if it was like this when you went to high school,
but I was just thinking about this.
Like, when you're in middle school,
you kind of get to flex a little bit.
Like, you know, if you're in seventh or eighth grade,
whenever you switch over,
you're kind of like the big kids in middle school.
And you have a sense of, like, you're 12 or 13.
You're like, "We made it."
In the Jewish faith, you even have a bar mitzvah.
All these things are happening at that age
where you're kind of like, "We made it."
And then you turn 14,
you get knocked right back down to size.
Now you're a freshman.
That's a scary day, man.
You might have been the cock of the walk,
but now--yeah, fresh-- fresh first day of high school.
First day of high school?
That's a classic one.
That's--yeah, it's like--
it makes you think of Freaks and Geeks.
Whoo!
That's a weird one.
But anyway, so, you know,
I remember being in freshman high school
and not knowing if I was gonna--
what it was gonna be like, and I remember--
I met a bunch of people.
Raj was a senior when I was a freshman.
We both were into music,
and very influential person in my life.
Taught me a lot about music,
and he continues to make music, as do I.
So anyway, Raj is gonna call in
and talk a little bit about his article.
Cool.
♪ There's something bad about to happen to me ♪
♪ I don't know what, but I feel it coming ♪
♪ Might be so sad, might leave my nose running ♪
♪ I just hope she don't wanna leave me bad ♪
♪ Don't you give me up, please ♪
♪ Don't give up on me ♪
♪ I belong with you, don't leave me bad ♪
♪ Only you, my girl, only you, baby ♪
♪ Only you, darling, only you, baby ♪
♪ Only you, my girl, only you, baby ♪
♪ Only you, darling, only you ♪
♪ Something bad is 'bout to happen to me ♪
♪ Why I feel this way, I don't know, maybe ♪
♪ I think of her so much, it drives me crazy ♪
♪ I just don't wanna leave me ♪
Don't you get me off, please
Don't ever want me
I belong with you, don't leave me
(Only you, my girl, only you, baby)
Only you, darling, only you, baby
(Only you, my girl, only you, baby)
Only you, darling, only you
(Instrumental)
What if she's fine, it's my mind that's wrong
And I just let bad thoughts linger for far too long
What if she's fine, it's my mind that's wrong
And I just let bad thoughts linger for far too long
Don't you get me off, please
Don't ever want me
I belong with you, don't leave me
(Only you, my girl, only you, baby)
Only you, darling, only you, baby
(Only you, my girl, only you, baby)
Only you, darling, only you
Now, let's go to the Time Crisis Hotline
(Phone ringing)
What's up, Raj?
Hey, how's it going, guys?
Hey, how you doing, man?
Not bad.
So, it was very cool to see that you had this op-ed in the Washington Post.
Yeah.
The title of the op-ed was "Indian Americans Won't Be Safe As Long As The White House Is Inciting Fear."
So, I was curious. I just want to kind of share that with our listeners and talk about what inspired you to write this.
Ever since the election, really, it's been, I think, for everybody, just been confusing time.
And it's just, you know, I've been sort of finding different ways to process it all.
And, you know, I spent basically 10 weeks after the election working on a mixtape that kind of dealt with how we got here and where to go next.
And that was all before the inauguration.
And post-inauguration, things just kind of got worse and worse.
Hate crimes are on the rise, and particularly against Indian Americans, there's a rash of them.
And I felt pretty compelled to speak out because I saw people in my community on social media and elsewhere, you know,
basically calling on Trump after one of the most egregious ones where, you know, there was actually somebody killed.
It was an Indian engineer working in Kansas for Garmin.
He was shot by his assailant after the assailant yelled, "Get out of my country," or something.
You know, just I saw so many people in my community saying, you know, calling on Trump to denounce the attacks and, you know,
waiting for him to make some sort of forceful comment on it.
And I just felt like that was a useless approach to tackling the issue,
because the real story here is that the Trump administration, no matter what sort of lip service they might offer their actions or speaking volumes,
just in terms of the Muslim ban and, you know, calling for a border wall and pointing Jeff Sessions, who's a racist of epic proportions,
as attorney general, like, that's the stuff we need to be fighting.
And so I basically wanted to stop everything I was doing and write a piece to call on Indian Americans, South Asians in general,
to stop asking for apologies for their denouncement of the hate crimes from Trump and to start organizing.
One thing that I found interesting about your piece and that I kind of related to in my own way,
you point out the need for solidarity across boundaries, because it's kind of interesting in America, like a lot of times we talk about
sometimes one horrible thing happens to a specific community and we focus on that community,
but you also were talking about the ways in which it's all kind of interrelated, too.
Well, yeah, with the shooting of Srinivas Kuchipothila in Kansas that I was talking about in the article,
the person who shot him, the reports say that that person mistook him for a Middle Eastern person.
So ultimately, the anti-immigrant sentiment and policy and xenophobia that's directed at Muslims, it's affecting all of us.
And so there's Islamophobia within the Indian community.
And in the article, I talk about a fundraiser that Trump held in Edison, New Jersey, which is like a big Indian community there in New Jersey.
And I remember it was in like October of last year, and I remember reading a BuzzFeed article about it the day after it happened.
It's just amazing to me, the level of Islamophobia was like a theme of the evening, basically.
Like before Trump spoke at it, they had all this entertainment.
And apparently, like they have videos of it online.
There was this dance sequence where couples are doing like the fox trot and then these terrorists ostensibly with lightsabers come out and start like attacking these
dancers.
And then they're rescued by Navy SEALs and then they all start dancing.
They're born in the USA. It's like totally crazy.
So bananas.
But like at that event, Trump said to the audience, I'm a big fan of Hindu.
I just want to point that out because that's jumped out of me in an article.
Trump is at a Hindu American fundraiser.
I imagine there weren't a lot of Muslims in attendance.
And so there's this kind of like bananas, terrorist dancing.
And then when Trump takes the stage, he doesn't say I'm a big fan of the Hindu community.
He literally says the sentence, I'm a big fan of Hindu.
Yeah. And like, you know, fast forward whatever, four months later and he's showing his cards that he's not such a big fan of Hindu.
And he's been reluctant to say anything about any of the recent hate crimes against Indians in this country.
And so, yeah, I mean, I think instead of giving money to politicians, Indian Americans need to run in greater numbers.
And I think we need to cross boundaries, sects of Sikh and Hindu and Muslim and start to realize that there's an attack on us all.
And together is probably the only way we're going to effectively fight it.
So tell me about the grizzly bear cover you just released.
Rough Trade asked me to be part of this great 90 day project that they're doing called The Song of Day Keeps the Pain Away.
And it benefits Southern Poverty Law Center. And they release a song every day for the first 90 days of Trump's administration.
And I decided to cover Grizzly Bear's Foreground, which is one of my favorite songs.
And my read on the song, it's about like a relationship falling apart.
And I kind of projected that on maybe how I'm feeling about my relationship with this country at the moment.
And it's bookended with two verses that take on the issues with xenophobia and nationalism that are at the fore right now.
So, yeah, I released it last week and reception on it's been really great.
And I'd like to play it for you guys.
Cool.
When the waters come crashing down in Babylon, justice of the peace turn around and bangers gavel on people in the streets.
Give them heat if it's Ramadan. They always hated you and always will.
And the Pentagon eyes wide shut on a bomb.
Hella hypocritical when they the only ones holding nuclear arms.
Rap phenomenon, lush V to rock, tell them.
Take away the coffers of the bankers and the war mongerers and expel them.
Follow the motion.
Arms in the air, hands in the air.
Work on another day.
Something's marked, another justice.
It is a foreground.
Oh, those countrymen, take direction, get collected.
I'm afraid they say, dead detected, not in ranking.
Fall in, or take flight.
Have a thought, or push it, soften.
Something about this life.
Take all evening, I'll just be cleaning.
It is a foreground.
Oh, little jimmy, matter evolving, motion and soften.
Something about this life.
Take all evening, I'll just be cleaning.
Matter of fact, I'm the young Abyssinian, young Hindustani, Pakistani and the Indians.
We all look the same, do a merengue condominium.
Look at down plot and how to get us out the paint.
Why they ruin the millennium.
How you gonna practice self-care when you want welfare?
And the first order of business is to take your health care.
Elsewhere they dropping bombs like lightning.
Wicked white men is hyping men and it's frightening.
I don't need to tell them that the world is steady hanging in the balance, so keep hyping it.
Daily acts of protest, daily acts of unrest, daily acts of violence till they changing in the next step.
Cool, thanks a lot Raj. So you're about to go on tour?
A little bit later this year, I'm just wrapping up a new record.
Should be done in the next couple of weeks, fingers crossed.
And I don't know if I can allow to talk about this yet, but I just signed a book deal.
So kind of wrapping up some stuff on that.
Oh, sick.
I think we're planning some dates for the summer and onwards.
Awesome. Any final thoughts that you want to leave the Time Crisis listeners with?
Oh yeah, FDT.
Time Crisis with Ezra King.
Beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep.
One.
Obviously we haven't been going too deep on politics on Time Crisis lately.
We've been sometimes taking a breather to talk about Home Depot and some of the finer things in life.
But of course, it's never far from our minds.
It was really nice to hear from Raj and I really recommend everybody check out his op-ed
because it kind of shows one of the oldest lessons that we have that no form of hate is tolerable.
It's nice to see obviously people we know educating others.
Yeah, that's great.
Well, what can we do given how horrible the world is,
given how much we all need to educate ourselves every day,
continue to donate money to places like the ACLU, Southern Poverty Law Center.
I get four emails a day from John Ossoff.
Who's that?
He's a 30-year-old dude running for Congress in Georgia.
Tom Price, who is Trump's appointee to head up the Health and Human Services Department.
Okay.
So he was a congressman from Georgia.
He got the job from Trump, so he vacated his congressional position.
And so there's an open seat.
Oh, in a special election.
In this suburban Atlanta district.
And John Ossoff is a 30-year-old kid, a Democrat, running.
And it's neck and neck.
A 30-year-old man, Jake.
30-year-old man.
You can't be putting that kind of energy out there.
John Ossoff is a 30-year-old man who is running.
So Trump won that district by a single percentage point.
We got a tie ball game in this district between the Dems and the Republicans.
And John Lewis noted Trump enemy.
Yes.
Is all about John Ossoff.
And so there's a lot of national energy and money being focused towards this race,
which is in April sometime.
It's coming up.
Right.
And so this is the exact stuff that right when Trump was elected,
the things that we told ourselves was like, OK, this is really bad.
However, there's midterm elections.
Yeah.
There's going to be opportunities for the Democrats.
They can't take back the White House anytime soon short of impeachment.
Crazy.
Or something crazy.
But there are ways in which we can do this on a local level.
Yeah.
And so this right here is a sterling example,
a special election where the Democrats could win one more seat in the House.
So John Ossoff is a 30-year-old man.
What else do you know about him?
Not a whole lot.
He's from that region.
He sends a few too many emails.
Yeah.
So, yeah, I watched some YouTubes of him.
And I just like, you know, I'm on these mailing lists.
So I became aware of him a while ago.
So then I was like, yeah, there's a lot of national momentum and energy on this race.
And people are like, if he can win this seat in Georgia, that's a good sign.
That's momentum.
That's like a good harbinger of things for 2018.
So, anyway, I'm giving him $5 a week until the election, which is in April or May or something.
So, yeah, it's a pretty small in terms of like energy and money,
a pretty small drop in the bucket from me.
But I just, you know, anyway, so I get four emails a day from him about it.
I'm looking at a picture of John Ossoff.
He's a good-looking guy.
Yeah.
And he has a beard.
He kind of looks like a barista, but at like a nice place.
And there's a ton of money coming in from the RNC running ads about him.
And they found some like goofy videos of him from when he was in college.
What was he doing, rapping?
No, he was like in like a a cappella group.
Oh, God.
You know what they were doing?
What?
They were doing Billy Joel, Uptown Girl.
And what's the problem with that?
I don't know, it's a great song.
Oh, what?
It's like, what's the--
Now the Republicans got a problem with Billy Joel?
Yeah, it's insane.
They don't like the class anger of Uptown Girl.
That's true.
The Republicans, they don't want--
They don't want to talk about class.
They don't want downtown guys and Uptown Girls getting together.
They want that downtown guy to die because he doesn't have health care.
They don't want Billy Joel to marry Christie Brinkley.
I think it's exciting, like a really young man, 30-year-old guy running for Congress.
I think that's cool.
That's great.
We should have him call in.
Let's try to get him for the next show.
Check him out.
One more Democrat down in Georgia?
Yep.
Come on.
It's a no-brainer.
Okay, so far we know at the very least he was in an acapella group.
We haven't found out anything bad about him.
And they sang Uptown Girl.
I mean, come on, it's pretty good, right?
John, this one's for you and your golden pipes, bro.
All right, so you ready for our second call of the day?
Yep.
Now this one we're going over to the lighter side.
We looked at some of the darkness in the world,
and now we're going to remember the reason why we care
is because there is beauty in this world.
The reason why we want the world to continue and people to live in freedom
is so they can enjoy the beauty of the world.
And what's often referred to as one of the most beautiful pieces of art
is not Seinfeld the series.
That's--
Middling.
But the Seinfeld theme song.
Jake's doing some air bass already.
[imitates air bass]
I want something to cue it in.
I want to hear it.
Can we listen to it before--
Yeah, let's listen to it because we're going to talk to the man who composed this.
Oh, I forgot about those horns.
Well, because, you know, they have to have little bumpers
for, like, different moments in the show.
I thought it was just--
In my memory, it was just pure unaccompanied bass.
This is, like, full.
Well, there's so many versions.
Oh, my God.
I love it.
That's probably what you're thinking of.
We have to ask this guy if he played the bass.
If it's him playing, it must be, right?
It almost sounds like a synth bass.
Yeah, maybe you're right.
That sounds synth-y.
And you hear that--
[imitates synth bass]
Well, anyways, we're going to talk to this guy, Jonathan Wolfe.
Well, it's '89.
Is that when the show started?
Yeah, the show--
People, you know, "Significant 90s Show,"
people forget that it started in 1989.
So that's--yeah, if it was, like, a synth slap bass,
that seems perfect for '89.
Yeah, we'll find out.
There's definitely some programming happening.
All right, so let's get on the phone with Jonathan Wolfe.
Now, let's go to the "Time Crisis" hotline.
[phone ringing]
Jonathan, what's up, man?
Ezra, what an honor.
I'm so pleased to hear from you.
Likewise.
You're also on with my co-host, Jake,
and we're very psyched to have you on the show.
Hey, what's up?
I'm happy to be here.
Thanks for bringing me up.
So, Jonathan, we talk about Seinfeld all the time on this show,
so it's really incredible to have you on.
We were just listening to the theme song.
So this was 1989 when you get the call to compose this theme?
Yeah.
What were you doing then?
Were you already kind of in the TV composing game?
What was your background?
Yeah, I was already doing a few series.
I was already had "Who's the Boss?"
and "Married with Children" and a bunch of other shows.
But I got this phone call from Jerry Seinfeld.
Had you ever heard of him at that point?
No, no one had ever heard of him.
He had one HBO special, and this was his big shot at doing TV.
And he described to me a sound design issue.
It was not really a music issue so much.
He wanted his opening credits to be Jerry Seinfeld
standing in front of a group of people.
He tells jokes, they laugh.
And he wanted theme music to go with it.
Now, you're too young to remember this,
but in the '80s, theme music was melodic.
We did a lot of sassy saxophones and silly lyrics,
and I'm guilty of all that.
But it was not going to work here.
To use those would have been a recipe for an audio conflict
with his voice, so I pitched him,
"Hey, Jerry, how about this?
"Your human voice is the one we need to hear.
"How about that's the melody of the Seinfeld theme?
"Every monologue you do will be a variation on the theme,
"and my job will be to accompany you in a way
"that is the elements will be thematic.
"The organic nature of your human voice,
"talking and telling jokes and people laughing,
"might go well with the organic nature
"of my human lips and tongue, finger snaps, like this."
[claps and beatboxes]
-Ah, oh. -And I had his attention.
-So he comes at you... -Yeah.
-...with already a very forward-thinking, out-of-the-box idea.
He's like, "It's already 1989. It's almost the '90s.
"No more of the schmaltzy..."
-"Alan Thicke." -"Alan Thicke stuff."
Yeah, this is not gonna be pretty pictures of his cast
over a silly thing. No, it's him doing--
And that whole notion of getting away from the show
and presenting, in his case, comedy material,
aside from the plot of the show,
was kind of groundbreaking in itself.
Right. So he's basically saying to you,
"I need instrumental music, but that's still gonna feel
"kind of thematic and fit with 'Go Under My Stand-Up.'"
-Yeah. -So you get the idea
that you want to do something kind of a cappella,
essentially, using the sounds that you can make
with your own voice.
Were you influenced by, like, Bobby McFerrin?
Where does this idea come from?
Everybody's influenced by Bobby McFerrin,
even if they don't know it.
-Sure words. -But mostly, I just wanted to get his attention.
'Cause when you're doing a pitch,
that's the most important thing, is that they're not looking around.
So I got his attention with that,
and said, "Come on over, Jerry. Let's see what you got."
So he came over and showed me his HBO special,
and I watched it and noticed that his delivery,
the way his voice goes up and down,
and his motion, he kind of put a clock on it.
[ Clicks tongue ]
About 110. And so, okay, that's...
Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on. Hold on.
So you're watching Jerry Seinfeld do stand-up,
and your musical mind, the gears are turning,
and you're like, "This guy tells jokes at 110 beats per minute."
Well, it's kind of reverse engineering the music for his choreography.
Right, but you felt a natural musicality and rhythm in his stand-up.
Yeah, he kind of moves, and he gives visual cues.
He moves with his elbows and his fingers.
He does -- If you watch him, he does --
It's not obvious,
not like Michael Richards' kind of physical comedy,
but he does move with his jokes.
And I put a clock on it, and that's where I clocked it.
I said, "Let's try this and see how it works."
And it seemed to have a nice groove to go with him.
The bass that people know that I added after that,
you know, 'cause you got to have some kind of musical element.
At the time, slap bass had not yet enjoyed celebrity status
as a solo instrument.
At the time, it was, you know, an element of funk music.
-Jocko? -What's that?
-How about Jocko? -Jocko was not really doing --
Yeah, again, just like McFerrin, everybody loved Jocko.
But that was not really his signature, the slap bass, right up front,
at least not that I'm aware of.
Right, he was more that smooth, fretless...
-Okay. -Correct.
He was a fretless monster.
Is that a real bass on the Seinfeld?
Well, it was when I sampled it.
Okay, break that down for us.
To create a sonic brand,
something that's a new species of music,
as you know, sometimes you got to break a few rules.
You got to do some audio gene splicing.
At the time, sampling, editing technology was in its infancy.
We had really crude, rudimentary tools.
But I wanted to do it, so I sampled several of my basses.
Just getting those samples, and then tweaked them and played with them
and created this kind of Frankenstein combination of those samples,
which became the Seinfeld sound.
Loaded them all, mapped them out onto a keyboard
so that I could play it superhuman.
You know, because there are certain things that --
So it was real bass sounds, but you were kind of performing it on a MIDI keyboard?
Correct, yeah.
Nobody's that superhuman to do the kind of stuff I was doing.
Wait, wait, I'm sorry.
You're saying that no one could physically play those lines on a bass?
Some of them. Some of the stuff I was doing.
The bends.
Well, yeah, some of the sounds --
I was wondering about the bends.
I'm sure some, but, you know, Thundercat could play the lines,
but it's not going to have that --
There are certain elements of the sample quality,
the way things get cut off, that would be impossible for a live bassist.
Copy that.
Correct.
And things that happen to the tone and the texture
when you pitch bend and you use the mod wheel
and things like that that are just not natural sounding.
And I kind of like that.
There was even -- I did --
Just to make it pop a little bit more,
I took a narrow band of --
I don't even remember what the band was.
Somewhere around 1.5 or 2k and phase reversed it,
put it back in, see what it would do.
And what it does is it really jumps out.
So it's a sampled bass, and all the other elements are snaps,
and you definitely hear that "ah" like a vocal sound.
Everything else is also sampled organic sounds?
Yeah, pretty much.
Well, there's those horns, those kind of cheesy late '80s --
What keyboard was that? You remember?
I don't remember. It was all samples.
I was deep into sound.
I can tell you that I was probably serving samples off of Sample Cell,
which was a PCI-based sample server.
How old were you in 1989?
I want to paint more of a picture.
I would have been 31.
So you're 31, 1989.
Yeah.
What kind of music were you into outside of your work?
Were you listening to, like, hip-hop?
You had, like, the first "Dayless Soul" album?
Your sentence does not compute outside of my work.
I was working like a fiend.
I was working like crazy.
My regular scheduled work week, Ezra, was over 100 hours a week.
Good Lord.
Just because I had that fear, that rush that all musicians have
at some point in their life where, "Man, people are calling me
and paying me money to create music? Really?
I'm going to take those jobs."
When you're flavor of the week, a lot of people call.
So I was taking a lot of work.
I was flavor of the week way longer than I probably should have been,
but I was taking all those jobs.
So I really didn't have a whole lot of time to listen to stuff.
My music editor, a guy named Jack Diamond,
it was his job to make sure that I heard what was important.
Every new album that came out, he would critique it.
He would pick cuts on it that I had to listen to
and make sure that I at least was aware of the lexicon.
So like season 2 of Seinfeld, he's like, "There's a new band called Nirvana.
You got to listen to them."
Really? They were new in '91?
Well, that's when the big album dropped in '91.
'89's funny though.
Was it like Motley Crue, like Dr. Feelgood record?
Throw that on.
I was into rock, so yeah, those were my bands.
'89 was a good year. Fine Young Cannibals, She Drives Me Crazy.
That's '89, great song.
And it was fun. Fine Young Cannibals, fun.
They didn't mind, it was fun.
They weren't so serious. I love that about them.
Yeah, they were great.
Well, you know what, Jonathan?
I don't know if you know, but one member of the Time Crisis crew
is a legendary Seinfeld fan called Seinfeld2000.
I believe you've come across his work.
I love that occasionally I just drop in and leave a little Easter egg,
little comments and things.
I love that there's a format for that, like Seinfeld2000,
for me to reminisce a little bit.
So thank you for that.
He's keeping the flame alive, but he's here in the studio.
Jonathan!
And we--okay, he's already on the mic.
How are you?
Okay, I was going to introduce him, but--
Jonathan, I'm very excited. Sorry, I just jumped right in.
Yeah.
Jonathan, I usually play the background,
but the fact that you're on the show, I just had to get on the microphone.
One of the things that I do with the account is
I like to imagine what Seinfeld would be like today.
Do you ever think about that?
Like if the show was still on the air,
what Jerry and the gang would be up to if it was still on television?
Oh, God.
I really don't think about those kind of things.
The reality is we lived that experience for nine years,
and we're deep into--and we quit.
We stopped doing it for a reason.
It was time to do it.
You know, you have to get it while you're on top before it gets stale.
A lot of shows--and I've worked on those shows--stayed too long at the fair,
and they got stale.
The creative juices that folks like you and others
who put Seinfeld in modern times with cell phones and electric cars and stuff--
iPads.
They are way more creative than we probably would be at this point.
Wow. Okay, I accept that.
You know, it seems to me like you were part of the evolution of the TV theme,
and after Seinfeld things became just a lot shorter, the lyrics went away.
I guess what I'm building up to here is that, you know,
a couple years after Seinfeld comes out, a show called Friends comes on the TV,
and they've got this damn four-minute-long intro with claps and lyrics and stuff.
Did you guys ever just, you know, just watch that intro and just go,
"Oh, God."
I don't know if it was actually four minutes long, but okay.
It felt four minutes.
240.
Yeah, 240.
Seinfeld kind of juxtaposed itself with Friends as the not-Friends show.
You know, Larry had certain rules--no learning, no hugging,
which is the opposite of Friends.
You know, that theme, it splashed hard, and it still lives.
People still know it. People still think of it.
So all I can do is salute that theme and, you know, wish them well.
I did plenty of shows like that that were kind of generic sitcom.
Friends, however, did it really, really well.
You know, those characters they had--you know, I don't really watch TV.
I didn't watch Friends a lot, but I know who the characters are,
and I recognize those actors when I see them from being Friends.
Here's a little factoid.
After Seinfeld, Larry David did a movie.
Sour Grapes.
It was awful.
Sour Grapes, that's right. You're the one.
I did the music for it, and there was--did you actually see Sour Grapes?
I did. I didn't know you did the music for it, though. That's awesome.
There was--one of the actors was a sitcom actor on a sitcom
that was lampooning Friends.
You remember that?
And I wrote--there was actually an opening credits,
kind of like that opening credits for Friends,
so I got to write, you know, a fake Friends.
Within the Larry David film Sour Grapes, there's a Friends parody.
Yeah, yeah, and I think the song was "I'll catch you if you fall"
instead of "I'll be there for you."
It was pretty weird, but, you know, it was a job, and I did it.
You just check that out.
The rest of the movie, not so much.
You know, just one more question, I guess.
You and Jerry ever still chat?
You guys ever, you know, shoot the shit about music?
Ha!
That kind of thing.
Not really.
He--I'm retired. I fully retired in 2005, by the way.
Good for you.
Yeah, yeah, it was time.
My wife and I decided that our family needed me more
than Hollywood needed more of my music,
so I retired and became a full-time PTA room parent
and sports assistant coach and field trip chaperone
and did that for about 10 years.
Now the kids are older now, and they don't need me 24/7,
but for a while I did that.
When I first started on Seinfeld, Jerry and I used to hang a little bit.
We were both single, we were both guys about the same age,
and we would hang a little bit, and it was fun, I guess.
What do you think of the Curb Your Enthusiasm music?
It's fun. It's good. It stays out of the way.
Let's keep it real. Not as forward-thinking as the Seinfeld theme.
He didn't, you know, there's no new--it's not a new species of music.
He didn't reinvent a wheel.
On its own, it's not really a sonic brand.
It's not an earworm that would instantly identify
and create a signature for the show.
Actually, our producer's telling us that that's just library music.
That's probably true.
Didn't even hire a composer.
Here's a Larry David story. Ready?
I mean, see, I'm retired. I don't have to flatter anybody, right?
My last encounter with Larry--
and I'd worked with him since Seinfeld, as you already know.
I start getting these shot breakdowns and schedules and crew lists
and things for Curb Your Enthusiasm at my office.
And I didn't know anything.
No one had hired me. Larry hadn't talked to me about it.
I just started getting these materials.
So I just kind of ignored them for a while,
because I'm looking to retire, and it's on cable, which I don't really do,
until I start getting cuts, you know, actual tapes.
Now I've got to do what nobody wants to do.
I had to call Larry David, which put yourself--
you're putting yourself right into that target range.
You're in his scope now, because, you know, you're talking to him on the phone,
and I'd say, "Hey, Larry, Curb looks great.
You are funny. I'm really proud of you.
Thanks for sharing those materials with me, but I got to tell you,
I'm retiring, so let me help you get somebody else to do your music, okay?"
Mm-hmm.
And he says--
"What are you saying, Wolf? What do you mean?"
Oh, he had no idea.
He couldn't compute that maybe I'm not doing a show.
So Larry--and by the way, as you know from Curb,
Larry is lord of the gray area.
If you're not black and white with him, he will take advantage of you,
and you will lose.
So I said, "Larry, I'm going to make this as clear as possible.
I hope this is not offensive, but I am not the composer for Curb Your Enthusiasm.
I will never be the composer for--
I'm never going to write a single note of music for your show.
My name is never going to be in the credits.
Is that clear enough?"
And he says, "What are you saying?
You thought I was going to hire you?
I wouldn't hire you.
You're a hack."
Oh.
Wait, so why was he sending the tapes to your office?
Believe me, I don't want to go down that rabbit hole with him.
I just said, "I'll send them back."
But, yeah, of course he had assumed that I was going to do it
when I didn't want to do it.
Then he turned.
Which, as you know, he's really quite skilled at.
If you ever interview him, get ready.
He's going to pick a fight with you.
And you can't win because guys like you and me, we just go through life.
We're not looking for trouble.
He actively seeks it out because he minds it for comedy.
That's true. Curb Your Enthusiasm is all about Larry getting into trouble.
He is only comfortable when you are not.
So you were familiar with that.
You were just like, "All right, man, whatever."
Or you were like, "You know what, Larry? Go f--- yourself."
No, I did not. I just did not want to get in.
Because he will win.
If you get into an argument, he will win because he's a pro, and I am not.
So, "You know what, Larry, you piece of s---?
Why don't you just go dig in the library music
and use some old Polka or Klezmer?"
"You know what? That's all you deserve."
And he said, "I will do that."
"You know what, Wolf? I will do that."
I was just grateful that I did not have to recommend a friend to work with him
because, man, it's hazard pay.
We're going to Larry because he is just so unpredictable.
Now, he's also, lest the moment goes by, he's genius.
-Absolutely. -Probably the best writer I've ever worked with
because he's Larry David.
So there's that.
Understood. Well, that was a great story. Thank you for sharing it with us.
So, Jonathan, it's been amazing talking to you.
Finally, this is a song we've been hearing our entire lives.
We got all this new information about it, and I know the listeners are going to love this.
Well, I'm so glad that you noticed my music.
It makes me feel good that folks of different generations enjoy my work.
And, man, long may it wave.
It's going to live forever.
And if you're ever out there enjoying your retirement in Louisville, Kentucky,
and a little earworm kind of enters your brain,
we could always use some new interstitial theme music on "Time Crisis."
There's a whole bunch of young, hot, smart, strong music creators.
People like you. I had my turn.
I was at bat for a long time, and I hit that ball hard over and over again.
It's no longer my turn. It's your turn.
All you young folks, I travel around. I give lectures and concerts at universities now.
And I meet a lot of really strong music creators.
It's their turn to step up to the plate and do some really great music.
So you're not going to hear anything else musically from me.
I am fully retired. I wrote enough music.
There were 75 primetime network series that I did.
Okay, so that's a maybe?
[laughter]
No, okay, I got to say--
You're like Larry David.
I really--you know what, Jonathan?
I wouldn't want you composing music for "Time Crisis."
I don't need your music.
I really respect that, Jonathan, because I always say this.
You know, in the arts, I always respect people who retire,
not because I think people need to retire,
but because there's not a lot of people with the kind of generosity of spirit,
like with what you just said.
You know, you look at some of the old rockers.
They're going to cling to--you got to pry that career out of their cold, dead hands,
the idea that that kind of--you know, like you do your thing,
and you go enjoy life and let somebody else go put in those crazy 100-hour weeks.
You know, it's like I really respect that,
and especially that you're going out and encouraging young composers too,
because you don't see that a lot.
It's a lesson learned from Seinfeld, go out on top,
because I was still working when I--you know,
Will & Grace was still on the air, Reba was still on the air,
but it was time for me to leave, so that was a lesson I learned from Seinfeld.
Know when it's time to quit.
We appreciate that, Jonathan.
All right, great talking to you, man.
You too. Well, guys, thank you so much for reaching out to me.
It is an honor to speak with you.
I can't wait to tell my daughter, who's in college,
that I talked with Ezra Koenig tonight.
Oh, that's great.
And hey, I mean, I know that the composing music's out of the question,
but maybe you'll call in again.
We can talk about who's the boss, Reba, another one,
because I know you probably get mostly Seinfeld questions.
What do you think about that?
I'm happy to--yeah, you mean at the end of all of it,
most people want to talk about Seinfeld or Will & Grace,
but I'm happy to talk about any of them, and I enjoyed this a lot.
I'm happy to--if you guys are having a slow news day
and you want to reach out to me again, happy to talk to you.
Amazing. All right, thanks a lot, Jonathan. Great talking to you.
Thanks, guys. Bye.
Bye.
Nobody move, there's blood on the floor
And I can't find my heart
Where did it go, did I leave it in the cold
So please give it back, 'cause it's not yours to take
It must have fell when I lost my mind
I'm sweeping the cup, drowning it in pain
Somebody help, 'cause I can't find my way
Nobody move, nobody move
[harmonizing]
Ah
Somebody tell me how I'm supposed to feel
When I'm sitting here knowing this ain't real
I'm trying hard, but I give my heart to you
Just to watch you throw it in the trash
I've been struggling so long, I don't think I can hold on
Where were you when I needed you the most
Now I'm sitting here with a black hole in my chest
A heartless, broken mess
[harmonizing]
Wow, Jake, that was a hell of a call.
Amazing.
I gotta say, I really like Jonathan Wolfe's vibe.
Mm-hmm.
He seemed to have the right attitude.
He created this iconic piece of music,
and he's happy to talk about it.
He's got definitely a generosity of spirit.
He likes to share the stories.
But at the same time, he also allows that to be
a fun piece of his past.
Right.
It's history.
He's happy to talk about it, but it's also like,
you know, he doesn't need to go be out there
continuing to compose or using that to get other gigs.
Right.
That's cool.
That's a good place to be, man.
It seems like he has an inner peace.
All right, Jake, you ready for the top five?
Yep.
It's time for the top five.
Five on iTunes.
Oh, yeah.
So this week, we're going to do a comparative top five,
of course, but we're not going to go back to 1981.
We've been comparing this year to 1981 a lot
because of the Trump Reagan similarity.
We're going to go back to 1989 because that's the year
that Seinfeld began.
Yep.
Now we know Jonathan Wolfe was so busy,
he wasn't listening to a lot of pop music,
but just to paint a picture of the zeitgeist,
we're going to look at the top five songs of 1989
and compare them with the top five songs of iTunes today.
The number five song this week in 1989 was Rod Stewart.
He was chatted up for multiple decades.
Oh, is this Forever Young?
No, that was a little earlier, I think.
This is My Heart Can't Tell You No.
Do you know this song?
I don't know.
I love Rod Stewart, but I don't--
Ooh.
Ooh, listen to that.
This is kind of vaporwave.
So this is 17 years after Maggie Mae.
Yeah.
[MUSIC - ROD STEWART, "90.7"]
You're listening to 90.7.
I don't know this.
[MUSIC - ROD STEWART, "90.7"]
Listen to those synth marimba sounds.
[MUSIC - ROD STEWART, "90.7"]
I'm gonna wake up missing you, wake up missing you.
When the one you love's in love with someone else.
I wonder who wrote this.
(SINGING) Don't you know--
It was written by Simon Clymie and Dennis Morgan.
(SINGING) --to give me a break.
I love to think about Ron Wood hearing this in '89.
(SINGING) --try to convince myself there's time--
This song goes on and on.
Rod got bad so quick.
He was genius for like three years.
He had a lot of good '80s stuff.
Young Turks.
Yeah.
No, that's cool.
I'm pretty into Forever Young, too.
(SINGING) And if the rhythm of my heart
was like the beating of a drum.
Da-na-na-na-na-na-na.
You know, he had a pretty good--
That's-- yeah.
He had a pretty good unplugged in the '90s.
Did he really?
Yeah, he did a good version of "Reason to Believe."
Oh, yeah, that was a hit.
(SINGING) If I listen long enough to you.
Interesting voice, not really a songwriter.
Not really.
He wrote a few.
He co-wrote Maggie Mae.
Really?
Yeah.
He co-wrote some of those early '70s hits.
(SINGING) You wear it well.
But I think by this time, this was just
like schmaltzy songwriters bringing stuff into the shop.
Yeah, this is not my favorite.
He went full like kind of like heartthrob,
like soft rock heartthrob.
Yeah, and he's probably selling millions of albums.
So good for him.
OK, the number five song this week,
I don't think we're going to get a lot of new stuff--
OK.
--this week.
Do you remember this one, "Clean Bandit," "Rockabye,"
featuring Sean Paul and Anne-Marie?
No.
(SINGING) Calling love and devotion.
This is about the woman who works all night
to care for her child.
Oh, yeah.
Ha!
(SINGING) Falling to single moms out there.
Going through frustration.
Single mom anthem.
We were comparing this to "9 to 5" last time.
Right.
(SINGING) She works the nights by the water.
Oh, right, nights by the water.
(SINGING) She's going to stray so far away
from her father's daughter.
She just wants a life for her baby.
All on her own.
Hear that moody violin?
(SINGING) She's got to save him.
Daily struggle.
(SINGING) She tells him, ooh, love, no one's
ever going to hurt you.
Daily struggle, come on.
(SINGING) I'm going to give you all of my love.
Nobody matters like you.
Stay up there.
(SINGING) She tells him, your life ain't going
to be nothing like my life.
You're going to grow and have a good life.
I'm going to do what I got to do.
Stay up there.
(SINGING) So rockabye, baby, rockabye.
I'm going to rock you.
It's weird that Rod Stewart's song was number five.
He was just a superstar.
Yeah, anything he put out would have--
Yeah, probably.
--remotely melodic.
It would have just been a huge hit.
80-- what?
This is a better song.
Oh, yeah.
I think we said this last time, but this
is one of the few pop songs where the baby refers to a baby.
Yeah, literal baby.
(SINGING) Rockabye, rocka, rocka, rockabye.
Single mom, what you doing out there?
Facing the hard life without no fear.
I like that Sean Paul just starts his verse directly
addressing her, not by name, but--
(SINGING) Single mom.
Single mom.
(SINGING) What you doing out there?
Single mom.
(SINGING) What you doing out there?
I mean, that's something that only happens in a song.
I understand what's going on here,
and I like the sentiment of this song.
I like that it's about family and work and struggle, but--
Daily struggle.
I'm just picturing what--
Not every song has to make perfect sense.
Lord knows many people don't believe my songs make sense.
But I'm just saying-- so I understand the female singer.
She's talking about the mom and the mom's relationship
to the baby.
It's all third person.
So she's kind of-- but she--
Anne-Marie is saying she.
She does this, she does that.
She sings to her baby.
And then she takes on the voice of the mother.
So rockabye, baby, I'm going to rock you.
And then Sean Paul comes in, and he's actually the second person.
Single mom, what you doing out there?
Yeah, that's kind of interesting.
It's like Anne-Marie sets the stage.
This is what's happening.
And then Sean Paul's like, enough already.
I want to talk to this woman.
Hey, single mom.
[music - "rockabye"]
Rockabye, down by the grind.
Lift up your head, lift it up to the sky, yo.
Rockabye, down by the grind.
Angels around you just draw your eye.
Now she got a six-year-old trying to keep him warm,
trying to keep out the cold.
When he looks in her eyes, he don't know he is safe when she says.
She tells him, ooh, love, no one's ever going to hurt you, love.
I'm going to give you all of my love.
Nobody matters like you.
Stay up there.
She tells him, your life ain't going to be nothing like my life.
You're going to grow and have a good life.
I'm going to do what I got to do.
I was going to say, this song does stand out
compared to a lot of what we listen to in the top five.
Yeah.
I just can't think of too many other songs that are--
well, look, everybody knows this.
The vast majority of pop songs are about love and sex,
not maternal love or familial love, but romantic love.
Occasionally, they're about being rich or showing off money.
This is that rare topical song that's about a relationship
other than a romantic one.
I've got to give you props for that.
Let's go back to 1989.
You remember Roxette?
Oh, yeah.
Roxette is like--
Swedish?
Yeah, I think they're Swedish.
And they're like-- I think they're one of the biggest bands in the world.
They're a Swedish pop rock duo.
Kind of started in the '80s.
And I think in America, they had a few hits.
But globally, in Europe, they're giant.
Still?
Are they playing casinos in Switzerland?
Let's see.
They've sold 75 million records worldwide.
Wow.
They might even still be playing arenas.
You know?
They might be playing the arena in Malmo.
It must have been love.
That was one of their big hits?
I think so.
But it's all over now.
Is that Roxette?
I think so.
Or is that something else?
The hit they had that was number four in the charts in 1989
was called "The Look."
Oh, yeah.
This is kind of up-tempo.
[MUSIC - THE LOOK, "THE LOOK"]
It's the 1989 drum sounds.
[DRUMMING]
1, 2, 3.
Picture Jerry Seinfeld driving his convertible
over to Jonathan Wolfe's studio.
This is down "Sunset."
I've got to nail this.
My career hinges on it.
Jerry's just at this intersection of "Sunset" and "Gower,"
just staring into the sun.
Larry, this sitcom's our last chance.
Seinfeld has got to be a hit.
Jerry's like, I'm hungry.
Should I hit that "In-N-Out" on "Sunset"?
Maybe the Tommy's?
Jerry's eating his car by himself.
Just listening to Roxette on the radio.
[MUSIC - THE LOOK, "THE LOOK"]
Ooh, got a pile of unpaid bills in the passenger seat.
This is kind of a rap song.
[MUSIC - THE LOOK, "THE LOOK"]
It's a good song.
What a weird band.
She's got the look.
Aren't there many male/female groups anymore where each one
sings?
Right.
Duo.
There's plenty of groups that have men and women in them,
but usually it's like one is the singer.
You know what I mean?
Yeah.
Not a lot of Fleetwood Macs.
What's the last album you can think of where one song is sung
by a woman in the band and one song is sung by a man?
Like Arcade Fire or something?
Yeah, kind of.
Gene Clark and Carla Olsen?
Maybe Taylor Swift and Zayn Malik will start a band.
That could be it.
Back to number four in our time, 2017.
This is The Chainsmokers and Coldplay.
OK, we're back.
[MUSIC - THE CHAINSMOKERS, "I'VE BEEN READING BOOKS OF OLD"]
Did you remember that was the opening line?
Yes.
I've been reading books of old.
Do you remember the rest of it before I play it?
(SINGING) I've been reading books of old, the legends and the fold.
No, that part doesn't rhyme.
(SINGING) I've been reading books of old, the legends and the myths.
What's next?
(SINGING) Superman and Batman.
No, no, no.
(SINGING) And even Iron Man.
No, no, no.
He stays on Greek mythology.
Oh, yeah.
(SINGING) I've been reading books of old, the legends and the myths.
What's next?
(SINGING) Hercules and--
Close.
No.
Achilles and his gold.
(SINGING) Oh, Achilles and his gold.
(SINGING) Batman and his fists.
Oh, so he jumps that fast?
I think.
I don't want to check.
Achilles the Batman.
I like that harmony you came in with.
Let's try that again.
OK.
(SINGING) One, two, three, four, one.
(SINGING) I've been reading books of old, the legends and the myths.
Achilles and his gold.
Batman and his fists.
Two part, bro.
It's like rock set, dude.
That's right.
We're the new rock set.
So this James Murgers of Coldplay song's killing it.
(SINGING) The legends and the myths.
Achilles and his gold.
Achilles and his gifts.
I want to point something out.
Achilles and his kiss?
Achilles and his gold.
Achilles--
It should be Achilles and his heel.
And his kiss?
I don't know.
Achilles kissed.
Who's the dude that had his hair cut off and he lost his power?
Samson.
OK.
That's from the Bible.
I love that one.
That's an interesting story.
Oh, that's a Bible one.
That's a Bible story.
I just want to point something out.
I've heard people talk about when Chris Martin comes in the beginning of this,
they're like, oh, he's singing so low.
It's almost weird.
It's cool.
It's cool, though.
Do you know that meme that's like, my hands look like this so hers can look like this?
No.
It's a-- you would show a picture of some grizzled worker's hands to imply that these
hands are the hands of the person in the relationship who works so that her hands can look like--
I guess this is very heteronormative.
That's like old school.
Yeah, actually--
In reality, you're both working 50 hours a week in an office.
You both have super soft hands.
The reality in modern America would be like, my hands look like this-- horrible, gnarled,
overworked hands-- so that hers can look like this-- comparably overworked.
Anyway, my point was just that the meme is kind of like, we make a sacrifice here so
that this can be beautiful.
The hands of the working partner in the relationship-- it should be beyond gender-- but the hands
of the working partner are gnarled, full of scabs, dirt, so that the hands of the other
partner can be gorgeous, bejeweled, bedazzled, whatever.
I say all this because Chris Martin has to sing low here.
Yeah?
So he can go high later.
Exactly.
So Chris Martin's voice sounds like this.
[VOCALIZING]
His voice sounds like this here.
[MUSIC - CHRIS MARTIN, "SPIDERMAN'S CONTROL"]
Spider-Man's control, and Batman with his fingers.
Kind of the low end of his range.
I don't see myself at all at risk.
She said, where'd she want to go?
So that his voice can get high.
Yeah.
But he's not done yet.
No.
If this was the highest note, he could have sang the whole thing up.
Some superhero, some fairy tidbits.
Just something I can turn to, somebody I can kiss.
I want something just like this.
We haven't even got to the payoff yet.
[VOCALIZING]
I want something just like this.
All right, come on, Chris.
Show us why you picked this king.
Where are you going to take it?
Oh, I want something just like this.
Now you really feel the drop, because he went high.
I want something just like this.
I think it's over an octave.
I sing the first verse really low.
So the chorus sounds like this.
[VOCALIZING]
So the chorus sounds like this.
A little songwriting technique.
Picking keys is hard.
I didn't think about that a lot.
Yeah, I wonder if he came in and they were messing around with keys.
And then he was like, let's just drop it down even more, guys.
Yeah, or maybe he was already in that key and it just worked.
I mean, I'm sure Chris Martin is such a consummate professional singer-songwriter
that I bet he's so intimately familiar with his range.
Right.
I bet he's probably like, I can really now A high B.
Yeah.
E is a good key for me, because the fifth in the E is B.
And I can just kill it.
Right.
It's crazy.
Sometimes in the studio working on a song, you move something up a half step.
It's like night and day.
I always wonder about that.
Sometimes you look songs up and they're like, it's in E flat.
And you're just like, Jesus.
I've been working on a song in E flat.
It's such an awkward song to play on the guitar.
It's awkward for a guitar.
E flat's a classic key for piano.
Because some people learn to play on the black keys kind of.
So Beatles have a lot of songs in A flat and E flat.
Yeah, or like B flat.
You're just like, really?
I want to just do a better job of that.
I sing the first verse really low.
I sing the chorus just like this.
Da da da da da da.
Is that one octave you're doing?
What is that?
I sing the first verse really low.
I sing the chorus just like-- yeah, it's over an octave, I think.
Yeah.
Like an octave and a half?
I mean, some people think that's what songwriting is all about, is about intervals.
What, like jumping intervals, you mean?
Or the relation--
Or like just having it have a big harmonic spectrum.
Yeah, and these things kind of go in and out of fashion.
But for a long time, you know, the idea of a big chorus means that the vocals jump up.
You know who loves to jump up octaves?
Um--
One of Chris Martin's predecessors, arguably.
Bono.
Yeah.
Bono's also like a classic of just like--
(SINGING) With or without you--
Oh, dude.
You're tapped in.
Oh, wow.
Great minds.
(SINGING) With or without you, I know I can't live.
With or without you, I can't--
I can't--
I can't live.
I-- I-- I can't live.
With or without--
Jump the octave.
Yeah.
Jumping octaves is not easy, though.
Shout out to these guys.
These guys have great voices.
I can't jump the octave in every K.
Bono's crazy, too, because when he's singing really high, it doesn't even sound that high.
I remember like in high school being in a car and "With or Without You" was on, one of those Joshua Tree songs.
And I tried to like-- I tried to match his note.
And I had to do it in falsetto.
It's like-- (SINGING) With or without you--
But he's actually singing it like full--
Full voice, yeah.
Full voice.
He has a beautiful voice.
Yeah.
At that point, I was like, oh, whoa, I can't sing at all.
We all have to take the range God gave us and make it as good as possible.
And maybe you can expand it a little bit, but--
Yeah.
You know, Bob Dylan couldn't sing something just like this.
No.
Yeah, he made it work.
(SINGING) A single fuzz was really low.
Joshua Tree was only two years old in '89.
Three.
'87, bro.
'86.
Money on this.
OK, yeah, I think you're right.
Tariq came out in '87.
Yeah, all right, I think you're right.
Is it '87?
I wonder if they were still putting out singles like almost into '89.
Big album like that?
I don't know.
I'm curious.
They're still working on it.
Like One Tree-- what's that?
Like Red Dirt Town or Red Dirt--
One Tree Hill.
Yeah.
Yeah, you're right.
You're right.
It was March '87.
(SINGING) Hangin' on.
All right, let's go back to 1989.
Ah, this is a classic.
I was just talking about them.
Remember Milli Vanilli?
Oh, yeah.
For our younger listeners, this was the German R&B duo that was kind of put together.
The guys were chosen for their looks.
They were not actually the singers on the song.
And they would kind of pretend they would lip sync.
Live at their shows.
Live.
And nobody really cares about lip syncing, but they were lip syncing to other people's
voices.
And this is really crazy is that they won the Grammy for Best New Artist, and it was
taken back once they got caught.
Do you think that would happen now?
They did not sing at all on the album.
They could not sing straight up.
I just don't think anybody would pull that these days.
Right.
Because also, you don't need to be as good of a singer.
You could, with auto-tune, even people without great pitch can still express themselves on
the mic.
I remember seeing clips of the recording of that album, and it was like a middle-aged
guy singing the parts.
Like, "Girl, you know it's true."
Yeah, and famously, that's the song we're about to listen to, "Girl, You Know It's True."
Great song.
When they got caught, they were doing a live performance, and the tape started skipping.
And it kept skipping on, "Girl, you know it's true."
"Girl, you know it's true."
And they just kind of looked at each other, and just like, "Ugh."
God, that is like, can you imagine, sorry to sound, but can you imagine the pressure
of that?
So what are you doing back?
Well, I sat back and thought about the things we used to do.
It really made me...
Also, keep in mind, these guys were German.
That's weird.
I really mean that much to you?
Was it German dudes singing it, or American dudes?
"Girl, you know it's true."
That's a good question.
I mean, sick production.
This still sounds fresh, actually.
But can you imagine the pressure those guys must have dealt with every day?
No, you know what's really sad is that they became villainized, and one of the guys ended
up dying eight, nine years later.
Jesus Christ.
Like, depressed.
And I think back on drugs, medication, petty crime.
Oh my God, dude.
Let them live.
I have this weird memory of playing Little League and being on the mound at baseball
practice, pitching, and having this song coursing through my head.
I was basically replaying the song in my mind, in vivid detail.
And I remember my, like, it was like a TV show in my mind.
I remember my coach coming up and yelling at me.
I was listening to the song in my head.
Really?
And he was yelling at me, and I wasn't listening to him.
It's a super weird memory.
Drake!
Yeah?
Throw a fastball!
And you're just in your head, just like, how old are you?
Twelve?
And you're just on the mound.
I was listening to this in my head.
And you're just like, "Girl, you know it's true."
Yeah.
Joe Carpasassi.
Was the coach?
Coach Carpasassi, I'm sorry.
Get your head out of your ass.
I'm sorry, Coach Carpasassi, I got vanilla in my eye.
Well, you get it out, kid.
Really random memory.
My emotions start up when I hear your name.
Maybe a sweet, sweet voice was ringing my ears.
Stimulate my senses, girl, when you on me.
Now what you wear, I don't care how you dress.
I'm the reason that I like you, girl, you see what you are.
If I say to think about it, you rule my world.
You try to understand.
I'm in love, girl.
I'm still in love, girl.
I'm just in love, girl.
And this is true.
Girl, you know it's true.
Oh, oh, oh, I love you.
I had that Milli Vanilli full length.
Really?
Blame it on the rain.
They had two big hits.
That was another one.
I feel like they had three.
Do you remember Blame It On The Rain?
Yeah.
These guys are, well, I heard more after the fact.
'89, what a weird period.
'89, there were cool things happening.
You know what?
People are too hard on lip syncers, man.
Remember Jessica Simpson?
Oh, Ashley Simpson, I'm sorry.
Kind of.
She sang, she was a singer, but on SNL,
she was lip syncing to make herself feel more comfortable or something.
Or maybe her voice wasn't sounding good that day.
And it kind of really hurt her career.
And it was kind of like, man, who cares?
Right.
The funny thing is, people get more uptight about
vocals are this unique thing.
It's like if you found out the keyboards were on a track,
and the doo-doo, nobody would care.
What is it about vocals?
If you watch those '60s, a lot of those '60s--
Like Ed Sullivan or something?
Yeah, a lot of that's the instruments on tracks.
Maybe the vocals are just like a window to the soul or whatever.
That's the signature part.
But you don't think of Ashley Simpson with a distinct voice.
No, whatever.
I mean, she had a voice.
We all have voices, Jake.
I'm not even bashing-- I'm just saying like--
I guess I also just kind of feel like,
you know there's still some people who get all uptight about
who writes their own songs?
Yeah.
So there's still these old school people who'd be like,
"That pop star is not a true artist.
She doesn't write her own songs."
And then other people are like, "Who cares?"
Yeah.
What if there was just a different tradition where
there were people who were studio singers,
and other people would just go lip sync?
Like, none of it makes any sense.
Okay, maybe it's the deception.
Like in old school musicals, that's often the case.
A different person sings.
Right, but maybe it's the deception.
Basically, it's like, "If you're going to lip sync, come clean.
I want to know what I'm getting."
And so if I find out--
That would be interesting if just like a really attractive person
came out and they were just like--
"I didn't sing this."
Actually, these days, you know,
people kind of can build careers off of
pictures of themselves on Instagram
in a way that you used to have to be like a professional model.
But now you really can just share pictures of yourself.
I'm doing that.
You're doing it. We all do that.
Some people get more paid off than others,
but we all do that. We all post selfies.
Some people are like, "Oh, you know, what happened to real talent?
This person, they just have a million Instagram followers
just because they're hot."
Yeah.
And it's kind of like, life is meaningless.
Like, who cares?
Well, people don't like that as a takeaway.
Life is meaningless. Nothing means anything.
No one wants that as the takeaway of cultured entertainment.
I think the issue is the deception.
Right.
So I'm saying somebody should come out and not deceive.
Somebody should come out and be like, "Listen,
I am a pop star not because I write songs or sing,
but because I've got cool style."
"I'm working out eight hours a day."
"I work out eight hours a day. I don't even have time to learn the songs.
And I will be there for the photo shoots.
I will be in the video.
And you know what? I'll be at the concert,
and I'll be staying late signing autographs.
But yeah, you're not going to hear my voice because I can't sing."
I think a lot of people would find that refreshing
and would support that pop star.
It's kind of Trump.
Oh, God. Okay. Now I don't like it.
Yeah, it's kind of Trump just being like, "Listen,
I'm not a good person.
I'm not trustworthy."
"I have no talent."
"I have no talent, but I keep it real."
"Yeah, I'll lie to you, but I won't lie to you."
"I like this guy."
That's all you have to do is you can literally be like,
"I might be dishonest.
I might not tell the truth, but I won't lie to you."
Yeah, I don't think that would fly, man.
I'm going to try.
If there's anybody out there--
That'd be like a weird--
If there's anybody out there--
Like Andy Warhol-style art project.
Anybody out there who wants to be a pop star,
but doesn't write songs, doesn't know music, and doesn't sing.
No talent. Maybe has a dance.
No, I think your talent is your--
It's like reality TV or Instagram.
Your talent is your natural magnetism.
Right, natural charisma.
I guess what I'm saying is natural magnetism
might be more important than singing voices and writing talent.
Clearly.
Anyway, hit me up if you're interested.
Back to our time.
Sam Hunt, "Body Like a Back Road."
Remember this?
Oh, yeah.
Body like a back road.
Oh, yeah.
Fell about.
Persistent.
I like that.
Took him six weeks.
But I've been working on some stuff in a similar vein.
Not musically or vibe-wise,
but that feeling that I saw you once,
this person walking by with braids.
I didn't know you.
And I continued not to know you for six weeks.
And now, now we go way back.
There was a time we didn't know each other.
And now we go way back, like Cadillac sings.
They were in the same circles.
He was seeing a lot of her over that six-week period.
It wasn't just like, "I saw this girl at the coffee shop.
I've been obsessed with her."
And then six weeks later, I saw her again.
I feel like he's saying, like--
He's saying--
They were working--they were like on the same--
It took me six weeks to get--yeah, okay, I can picture it.
You know what I mean?
Maybe she's like the waitress at the local diner,
and he's coming in, and he's being like,
"I'm gonna say hi, and I'll get your number."
God, that's a funny dynamic.
And she's just like--it's a little bit of harassment.
You gotta just let it go.
If you're like a super cute girl working at a coffee shop,
you just have, like, 15 guys a day coming in.
Oh, Jesus.
Who are like regulars, like getting the coffee on the way to work.
Oh, God, what a nightmare.
I've seen that happen.
It's, like, brutal.
You're standing in line, and the guy's trying to get his 45 seconds
of FaceTime to flirt with her,
to try to, like, move the ball down the field--
Oh, God, is that what this song is about?
What?
Sam's like, "She worked down at the Starbucks."
Yeah.
Just, like, every morning--
I'm on my way to the job site.
I park my F-150.
I'm on my way to Home Depot.
You know what's also so brutal about that?
It's, like--I'm also just picturing it just, like, rush hour.
Just, like--you know when you go to Starbucks and there's, like--
Slammed.
You know, it doesn't take much to make a Starbucks feel full.
Just, like, 11 people in line.
Oh, my God.
It's just, like, 11 people in line just waiting, like--
just doing all this sh--.
People being like, "This is not what I ordered."
"Can I have the next guest?"
And then just, like, some dude just kind of lingering by the place
where they put the drinks out, just being like--
"Uh, so anyway, how was your weekend?"
Yeah.
"Um, it was pretty good, Frank.
"Can I get that macchiato?
"Oh, yeah, oh, that's cool.
"Are you doing anything special?
"Um..."
Just, like, what kind of maniac would just monopolize somebody's time like that?
Dude, I just remembered I actually asked a girl out that worked at a coffee shop.
Oh, God.
In 2000.
You're no better than Sam Hunt, man.
No, no, no, but here's how I did it.
It was a block from my place.
Yeah.
But here's the thing.
I was so self-conscious of this concept, and I would not linger.
But, like, I was in there enough so we knew each other's names,
and then I called her.
At the coffee shop?
No, I called her at home.
I don't know how I had her number.
Well, that's a pretty important part of the story is how you got her number.
How the hell did I have her number?
I don't remember.
That's incidental.
Was this pre-cell phones?
Yeah, straight-up landline, cold call.
And did you go out on a date?
Nope.
She just shut you down?
I think she had a boyfriend.
Oh, did you have to stop going to that coffee shop?
I think I took a breather.
Like a solid, like, 60-day breather on it.
It was fine.
It was not, like, a big deal.
Okay.
I mean, is there a way -- this is the Sam Hunt song situation.
I mean, look, there's marriages that started in a coffee shop.
Sometimes you meet people in unexpected ways, and it's a little awkward.
I mean --
You know, yeah, it's a tough one because you've got these, like,
scumbag pickup artist types.
For the record, I do not feel at all bad about asking that girl out.
And she seemed kind of -- I remember, like, my memories.
I was, like, 22.
Maybe she was, like, 27.
I think she was sort of like, "Oh, that's cute."
She wasn't weirded out.
It's maybe no different than any other situation where you ask somebody out.
Okay, I remember now.
I did an exhibition at the coffee shop.
I hung my art in the coffee shop for a month.
That's why I had her number.
And then I called her, and I was like, "Hey, I'm going to go see this
art exhibition downtown in a few days.
Do you want to roll?"
Chill.
That's -- okay.
That seems appropriate.
You guys had already established a relationship.
She was, like, organizing the art shows at the coffee shop, so I, like --
that's why I had her -- anyway, blah, blah, blah.
All right, well, all I can say is Sam Hunt.
I guess Sam Hunt it worked out.
Bought it like a back road.
Let's go back to 1989.
Bangles, Eternal Flame.
That's a good one.
This is a great one.
'89 is kind of popping.
♪ Give me your hand, darling ♪
♪ Do you feel my heart beating? ♪
♪ Do you understand? ♪
♪ Do you feel the same? ♪
This feels like it could have been written by, like, the Bee Gees.
Oh, this could be, like -- or, like --
1964.
Right.
But the Bangles were kind of throwback.
♪ Eternal Flame ♪
Did they write this?
Yeah.
♪ It's meant to be, darling ♪
♪ I'll watch you when you are sleeping ♪
What was their story?
I don't know anything about that band.
♪ Do you feel the same? ♪
Well, listen to this.
Yeah, this song was written by Susanna, who's the singer of the Bangles.
♪ Eternal Flame ♪
And then they go to this part, like --
Yeah, it's like weird '60s.
It's weird that this is only 20 years after, like, 1969.
I'm just tripping out on that.
Yeah.
It's, uh --
Like, the music from the '60s, from our top five of '68, you know,
from last year, it was, like, so relatively recent.
So this song was written by Susanna Hoffs, who was the singer of the Bangles,
but also with Tom Kelly and Billy Steinberg.
And I guess Susanna was telling Billy Steinberg about going to Graceland
and seeing some eternal flame that they have there for Elvis.
And as soon as Billy Steinberg heard the words "eternal flame,"
he immediately thought of the synagogue in the town of Palm Springs, California,
where he grew up.
I remember during our Sunday school class, they would walk us through the sanctuary.
There was one little red light, and they told us it was called "The Eternal Flame."
♪ Close your eyes, give me your hand ♪
♪ Do you feel my heart beating? ♪
♪ Do you understand? ♪
♪ Do you feel the same? ♪
♪ Am I only dreaming, or is this burning? ♪
♪ An eternal flame ♪
Okay, so she's saying, "Am I dreaming this love, or is it--?"
Yeah. "Am I delusional, or is this the real deal?"
That's a real question.
That's a question that every guy at the coffee shop has to ask himself
before he asks out the barista.
Because 99% of you guys are dreaming, are delusional.
Yeah, absolutely. And the barista can see it coming from a mile away.
Yeah, like the guy already, like that kind of fake smile.
"Mm, oh, mm."
♪ Do you feel the same? ♪
No.
♪ Am I only dreaming? ♪
Yes.
♪ Is this burning? ♪
Nope.
♪ An eternal flame ♪
It's not even a flame.
Nope, not even embers.
Let alone an eternal flame.
The matchstick broke, bro.
The number two song--oh, no.
The number two song in 2017 is Bruno Mars.
He's got a second hit single off this album.
The first one was "24-Karat Magic."
Oh, yeah.
♪ In the air ♪
Is this a new song?
Well, it's the current single. It's called "That's What I Like."
Gonna be new to me.
♪ Hey, hey, hey ♪
♪ I got a condo in Manhattan ♪
Oh, no, we've heard this.
Oh, maybe we did, yeah.
♪ Chew your ass and ride it ♪
♪ So gonna get to cappin' ♪
This is the one that's, like, wildly out of step with the feel of early 2017.
Right, this is good times music.
♪ I'm in the beach, I see Miami ♪
♪ Wake up with no jammies ♪
♪ Lost the tail for dinner ♪
♪ Julio served that scampi ♪
Oh, right, Julio.
Yeah.
♪ If you want it, said you got it ♪
♪ If you want it, take my wallet ♪
♪ If you want it now, jump in the Cadillac ♪
That's a cool song.
♪ Girls put some miles on it ♪
♪ Anything you want, just to put a smile on it ♪
♪ You deserve it, baby, you deserve it ♪
♪ Oh, hey, hey ♪
What's that Kanye song? He's like, "It feels like Atlanta."
Remember that one?
Yeah, that's the one that samples Michael Jackson.
It's like "Good Time."
"Good Life."
Oh, yeah, "Good Life."
♪ With T-Pain, welcome to the good ♪
Yeah, it samples PYT.
♪ That's what I like ♪
♪ Lucky for you, that's what I like ♪
♪ That's what I like ♪
♪ Sex by the fire at night ♪
♪ Silk sheets and diamonds, all white ♪
♪ Lucky for you, that's what I like ♪
♪ That's what I like ♪
♪ Lucky for you, that's what I like ♪
♪ That's what I like ♪
♪ I'm talking trips to Puerto Rico ♪
All right, Bruno Mars. I mean, he's--
Yeah, it's cool.
Yeah.
"Empty" is all get-out, but good.
Yeah, which is not to say that he's empty as a performer.
It's just, you know, any song that's only about...
being rich...
Right.
...is "Empty."
What's, like, the deepest song about being, like, rich
and just, like, living the good life?
The deepest?
Like, the one that, like, resonates emotionally the most.
Well, you know, like, some people--
That's a tough--
You know, like, "Notorious B.I.G."
The rich talk was always undercut with, you know,
like, the classic line,
"Super Nintendo, Sega Genesis, when I was dead broke.
Man, I couldn't picture this."
Right, right, okay.
Or that-- Or that--
The Ice Cube song?
Which one?
"Today Was a Good Day."
"Today Was a Good Day" is not about being rich.
That's about--
Oh, yeah, you're right.
'Cause in that, he's not rich Ice Cube.
He's still living at his mom's house.
Right, right, right.
'Cause his mom cooked breakfast with no hog.
In fact, that song is actually, like, dark in a way
because it's, like--
He gets pulled--
He's not saying, "Man, today was a good day
"'cause I got a condo in Miami,
and I woke up with no jam."
He's not saying that.
He's saying, "Today was a good day
because I didn't have to use my A.K."
That's right.
"Nobody died today."
Wow.
That's actually an incredibly--
That's--
That's talking about how good--
Just a normal day.
He played-- His mom made a good breakfast.
He played basketball with his friends.
He got a beep from Kim.
She can f--- all night.
He went to the Fatburger at 2 a.m.
Wait, is that in the song?
Yeah.
So I'm saying, like, that's about--
That's basically being, like--
It's crazy that--
Compare what he's talking about in that song
to Bruno Mars.
Yeah.
Like, he's literally just talking about
being in the neighborhood he grew up in,
wake up at your mom's house,
play basketball with your friends,
and have sex with somebody who loves to have sex.
That's a good day.
And the Fatburger.
And then go to Fatburger after the sex.
Bruno Mars would be like,
"Oh, you played basketball, had sex?"
"Well, I played basketball on the top of a condo
in Miami, and then I went on a PJ,
and I had sex on the PJ with three women,
and then I had steak."
And today wasn't even that good.
And today wasn't even that good.
That's the sentiment.
And hey, that's his experience.
That's Bruno's journey.
It's cool that the Cube song--
I haven't heard it in years, and in my mind,
it was like that.
Like, the emotional vibe of that song
is like the Bruno song,
even though the lyrical content is nowhere near it.
No?
My memory of that song is like--
It's just kind of eerie.
Like, think about the sample.
♪ Ooh-ah-oh, da-da, da-da-da, da-da-da-da ♪
What year was it, like '93 or something?
Early, yeah, early '90s.
Yeah, like, listen to it.
♪ ♪
This song always made me feel like--
Yeah.
♪ Ba-na-na, ra-na-na ♪
It's like a weird, eerie dream.
It's like, it's not--
The tone of--even just the instrumental, it's like--
It's like washy.
It's not happy--yeah, it's kind of chill wave.
It's not happy or sad.
♪ ♪
♪ Just waking up in the morning, gotta thank God ♪
♪ I don't know, but today seems kind of odd ♪
♪ No barking from the dog, no small ♪
♪ And Mama cooked the breakfast with no hog ♪
♪ I got my grub on, but didn't pig out ♪
♪ Finally got a call from a girl I want to dig out ♪
♪ Hooked it up a later as I hit the dough ♪
♪ Thinking, will I live another 24? ♪
♪ I gotta go 'cause I got me a drop top ♪
♪ And if I hit the switch, I can make the ass drop ♪
♪ Had to stop at a red light ♪
♪ Looking in my mirror, not a checker in sight ♪
Okay, so back to--
This guy, wildly sidetracked.
The number one--well, no, but it's cool.
Yeah, yeah.
You know, happiness is all about context.
Yeah.
So if you're Bruno Mars, you got all these houses and stuff,
it's not gonna be a good day for you
unless you get yet another house.
Whereas if you--
Insatiable appetites, brutal.
If you don't even have a real estate portfolio,
you're gonna appreciate the small things,
like getting a beep from Kim or whatever.
The number one song this week in 1989--
Oh, this is one of your favorites, Jake.
Wait, did we--oh, okay, we're '89.
Yeah, we're back to '89, the number one song.
Actually, you're the one who introduced me to this song.
Wait, wait, wait.
I'm sort of placing it.
I introduced this song to you?
Yeah.
Oh, "Living Years."
That's right.
Mike and the Mechanics, "The Living Years."
Oh, this song is deep.
So this song's about his dad?
Yeah.
This is some tearjerker.
That's true.
Baby boomers are doing a great job at running stuff right now.
Yeah.
I know that I'm a prisoner to all my fatherhell, so dear.
I know that I'm a hostage to all his hopes and fears.
I just wish I could have told him in the living years.
Ugh.
All right, so it summarizes the song.
Heavy, dude.
Well, his dad's dead.
Right.
And he's looking back with regret about the things I didn't tell you.
And also saying, "I know we had intergenerational beef."
We had straight-up strife.
And I bet Mike and the Mechanics guy was like a dude of the '60s.
Yeah, he was in Genesis.
Mike was in Genesis before.
So yeah, his dad's like a--
Old English guy.
Right.
And he's like--
He's running around with Peter Gabriel.
His dad's probably like a World War II guy, and then he has this, like, snotty rock star son.
Not even rock star, just like--
Yeah, he's like--
He's like a musician's son.
Oh, God.
He's growing his hair out, and he's just like, "Dad."
Dad, come see my progressive rock band.
And he goes, sees Peter Gabriel wearing, like, a costume, and his dad's just like, "Get a real job."
But, Dad, it's in 7/16 time.
I don't care.
A song shouldn't be nine minutes.
And then his dad drops dead in, like, 1982 or something.
Mm.
It's pretty, like, Springsteen-y, too.
Stilted conversation.
Man, it'd be tough.
Like, my parents and I see more of this eye-to-eye.
Like, for instance, like, with the last election.
Like, if my parents were Trump supporters, that would be tough, man.
That would be, like-- And I have friends that, you know, are in that situation.
It would be a real weird--
Man, I mean--
As you said, stilted conversation.
That's heavy.
Obviously, you gotta-- If your parents are making political decisions that ruin other people's lives, you can't take their side.
You have to limit your sympathy.
But at the same time, generally speaking, we consider family a permanent bond that you have to work through.
Absolutely.
I mean, a lot of people would say you don't have to--
You shouldn't give too much ground to Trump supporters.
Well, you don't have to give them any ground politically.
I don't know, man. That's a tough one.
Let's just look at the chorus for a second.
Say it loud. Say it clear.
You can listen as well as you hear.
It's too late when we die.
"Die" is such a heavy word, right?
To admit we don't see eye to eye.
You know what's brutal?
It's so much of life is just acceptance.
You know, like, there's-- This has been a very tough thing for me to learn in life.
This is classic. This is tough for everybody.
To learn that there's not always resolution in life.
And you want to believe that there's resolution in life.
And I can understand if you're somebody with very different beliefs than your parents
or like this guy's dad in World War II and he's just like, "They just don't get each other."
You want to believe that if you'd done something differently,
if you listened more or something, that there could have been a resolution.
But what's an even more bitter pill to swallow is sometimes it's not.
Not on the cards.
It's not always in the cards.
And, yeah, you know, that's life.
And I think that's the thing that's been really hard for me in life.
Should I have done something? Yeah, it's tough.
I mean, maybe that's the difference between him and Bruce Springsteen.
Because this song is like a little sentimental and a little maudlin and schmaltzy.
Because it's like, you know, the message he's putting forth, like, you don't really buy.
Like, you can listen as well as you hear.
And it's like, well, it doesn't work out that way.
But he's acknowledging the divide with his father and not trying to sugarcoat it with, like--
Like, this is brutal. Yeah.
This pain will haunt me. This pain will haunt me.
That's the Bruce-- Right.
Later, Mike, and the mechanics, says, "I wasn't there that morning when my father passed away.
I didn't get to tell him all the things I had to say."
That's brutal.
You ever heard a story like that, somebody wasn't there when a loved one passed and wished they were there?
But the tough part is that--
And maybe you would feel better if you got to say everything you wanted to say.
I certainly believe that. Sure.
But the tough part is even if you get to say all the things you want to say to a person,
it doesn't necessarily mean that resolution-- you're going to get resolution.
Yeah, or that's going to resonate with them.
I know. It's brutal.
Are you doing it for them or you?
Like, yeah, that'd be way more Bruce to be like, you know--
And look, this is this guy's lived experience, so I'm not trying to take away from it,
but just in terms of what it makes me think about, it would be more Springsteen-ian to be like,
"I went back one last day. I said all the things I had to say.
He just shook his head and I just walked away."
That'd be like some-- you know, that feeling of like--
Yeah, it'd be ambiguous.
Yeah. And it'd be like--
I did. Because sometimes-- that's a really brutal song.
This song is almost like, "I missed my chance to do what I should have done,"
and that's haunting in its own way, but to also be like, "I did everything I could,
and I was still left with a lack of resolution."
That's such an awful part of life.
Yeah. And the tone of this song is almost suggesting that he thinks he would have had--
it's like a naive hope and belief that he would have had the sense of resolution,
which I don't think he would have.
Now, doesn't the song end with like, "It's all good because it's the cycle of life and I--"
Well, yeah, he says, "I think I caught his spirit later that same year.
I'm sure I heard his echo in my baby's newborn tears.
I just wish I could have told him in the living years."
That's terrible. That's awful lyric writing. I mean, I get it. He's feeling it.
No, but you know what? You remember that song we listened to that--
I don't think you like Cat's Cradle? The cats in the cradle?
Oh, I hate that song.
But that song is about-- the singer of that song had conflict with his dad.
Right.
And then later, the end of that song is like, "And now I have a son.
And I have conflict with my son too."
The circle game.
So the circle of life, the positive spin is like people die, but new people come into the world.
And there's always a chance for redemption and hope, whatever.
But then the negative side is kind of like-- another way to look at it was like this guy had conflict with his father.
Later that same year, he had a baby.
And he realized that human life is suffering and it's hard to connect or something.
Bruce just would have never brought up his newborn baby's tear.
Uh...
He wouldn't have.
There's no way. It's too maudlin.
Yeah, he might talk about his baby.
As I hold my baby son in my arms
Late, Bruce.
I know there's nothing I could do
The factory was closing down and I'm done too
I said, "Daddy, I'm not in need."
You're born alone and you die alone
I hold my son, I pray to God his life won't be marked by these fears
'Cause there's nothing you can do
The hopes and dreams
'Cause I know he won't find happiness in the living years
When death's embrace takes my sweet son
I don't know.
But whatever. I still like this song and this is his experience.
Oh, that's a great song. I'm into this song.
It's a great song, yeah.
It's a little over the line, but I'm in.
That was the number one song in 1989.
The number one song in 2017 is not so concerned with that type of stuff.
It's a little more concerned with matters of the flesh.
You know what I'm saying?
Not as existential.
People gotta have sex.
Well, I mean, they don't.
Circle of life, dude.
The club isn't the best place to find a lover, so the bar is where I go
Bed sheets?
Yeah, exactly.
I like to imagine that--
This song is called "Bed Sheets," right?
Ed Sheeran is Mike and the Mechanic's baby son growing up.
Oh my God.
1989, he was held in his father Mike and the Mechanic's arms.
Was Ed Sheeran born in '89?
Wouldn't surprise me.
Wait, how old--Ed would make you 28, wouldn't it?
He's probably a little younger.
This is a massive song.
Yeah, it's big.
I mean, that's the circle of life.
It's like this pain that other people experienced in the past,
and then 28 years later, you're taking girls to a Chinese buffet
and making out in the backseat of the cab.
These are all parts of life.
I don't mean to imply that Mike and the Mechanic's are better than Ed Sheeran
because their number one song had more gravitas, 'cause the truth is,
as much as life is about haunting memories and death and the circle of life,
it is equally about Chinese buffets, making small talk, sensuality, lust.
Anything is valid subject matter.
That's right.
We should point out that Ed Sheeran gave songwriting credits on this song
recently to the people who wrote TLC "No Scrubs."
Oh, whoa.
Whoa, like 18 years ago or whatever?
Yeah.
That song's old.
I guess 'cause--I mean--
Wait, what?
'Cause there's a part of his song where he goes--
I may be crazy, don't mind me, say boy, let's not talk too much.
Grab on my waist and do the--
I guess--
No, I don't want your number, no.
I don't want to give you mine, and no--
Girl, I don't want--
That's a stretch.
I think it's a stretch, personally.
Ed Sheeran--
There's like a billion songs like that without cadence.
Ed Sheeran, I think, has been sued a lot lately, so he's probably a little--
He has?
Yeah, the Marvin Gaye's family sued him for--
He has a song that kind of has a similar groove
and some melodic similarities to "Let's Get It On."
Oh, really?
'Cause--
♪ Let's get it on ♪
And Ed Sheeran goes--
♪ 'Cause baby I know ♪
♪ Da-da-da-da since 17 ♪
♪ Let me into your love and all ♪
I don't know.
I always think that when it comes to suing people,
you should err on the side of eh.
You know what I'm saying?
Yeah, there's been 10 million pop songs.
There's going to be a little crossover.
I understand that people--
Well, first of all, there was once some commercials
for some random movie that had these brutal fake Vampire Weekend songs in it,
and it was funny 'cause one was fake A-punk,
and then right after it they played fake Oxford comma.
And I just remember watching those and being like,
"You know, we could go get the musicologist and try to be like,
'Mm, that's clearly based on this.'"
Another part of me was like,
"Clearly this is somebody making a wack version of our song. Case closed."
That's funny.
Like, it's funny and also--
I mean, what if that song had gone and become a huge hit?
Well, that's an interesting point.
Would you say it was a bad horror movie?
No, it's just some random comedy. It's like a low-budget comedy or something.
So yeah, what if someone wrote a blatant A-punk rip?
Instead of--
♪ Da-da-da-da ♪
It was just like--
♪ Doo-doo-doo, doo-doo-doo ♪
Some weird version.
It's hard to know where to draw the line.
It was like number one.
Well, that's an interesting question because then some part of you has to say,
"Okay, so the fact that it went number one, that's what made me finally sue?"
"Is because I got dollar signs?"
That's kind of not that strong.
It's not a good look for you.
And then I guess the lawyer would definitely make the case.
"This song, clearly inspired by A-punk,
is now representing itself in the marketplace,
doing grave damage to the commercial potential of my client's song, Ape."
And even that is like--I don't know, man.
Where do you draw the line?
Somebody could be like--
What's an example of somebody who has a similar vibe to somebody else?
Um--
I don't know. Remember we were talking about the Libertines in the last show?
Remember the Libertines were kind of like the English Strokes?
Right.
They looked similar, but they did their own thing.
It's still different.
You still know that they're two different things.
You know, what if the Strokes sued the Libertines?
I almost feel like that's going to happen.
We're going to get to a point where that happens,
where people are just like--
Remember that guy Skeet Ulrich?
And everybody was like--
That actor?
Yeah, he looks like Johnny Depp.
Okay.
He was just a dude who looked like Johnny Depp.
And no, he's a fine actor, but--
And people were just like, "Oh, he's the fake Johnny Depp.
He's the budget Johnny Depp."
People talk that way about actors a lot.
Or sometimes you think that you did something so original
and somebody takes a similar idea and does it better.
You got to just take that L.
Take that L.
Skeet Ulrich really looks like Johnny Depp.
Yeah, but you couldn't sue for--
I mean--
Yeah, that's the more thing with actors,
with someone is the poor man's version of so-and-so.
It's a little different with music.
Yeah, no, of course it's different with music.
I just think ethically, I'm not saying I would never sue somebody.
I would just try to draw the line as charitably as possible.
Right.
Also, you know what's tough?
There's also the thing about honesty.
It's like sometimes you can be inspired by a song and just lie about it,
but if somebody comes to you and is like, "Hey, listen, your song inspired it,"
and then you're like, "Okay, you're directly saying that you based it off of this.
All right, thank you.
Give you my piece."
But if I just hear something and I'm like--
We were talking about "Kids Don't Stand a Chance" before.
[singing]
That's such a basic idea.
If somebody came out with something and went,
[singing]
and had the same drum groove, I'd have to be like,
"All right, this is inspired by what we did."
But, like, whatever, it's lame.
I don't know.
Yeah, well, if they had a different vocal and, you know--
Whatever.
Ed Sheeran is--
It's over the line, I think, that he had to, like, give writing credit.
Maybe he did.
He's probably just scared of getting sued.
That sucks.
Although, maybe he got away with some other theft,
and he was like, "This is my penance."
Heavy.
Well, those are the top five songs of 2017 and 1989.
Wow, Jake, that was a hell of an episode.
Yep.
We talked to Raj Halder, Lush Life.
We talked to Jonathan Wolfe, composer of the "Seinfeld" theme song.
And we counted down the hits.
Some work he asked for.
I will see everybody in two weeks.
Thank you.
"Time Crisis" with Ezra King.
Beats 1.
(explosion)
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